[Applause]
All right, so here we go. As you can tell, things are going to be a little bit different today. There's no sermon, but what I want you to know is this whole series is really because when you have a relationship that is built on the Rock, when it is built on a Christian, godly, biblical foundation, you do have a healthier, stronger relationship.
When you are in a relationship that's kind of on the rocks, if you can get back onto the rock of Jesus Christ, then you will be able to fix a lot of those issues in the relationship. It's just a much healthier way to approach this.
So today, what we're going to do is have a panel discussion. I've got a few questions already loaded here, ready to throw at these amazing couples, but I would love for you to be able to add your voice to this. We're going to give you a chance to ask some questions, so pull out your cell phone right now. They're going to throw up on the screen, or it's over there in the middle. If you scan that QR code or go to that go link, you can actually ask some questions.
But we're going to kick things off actually with a poll. The poll is: What do you think is most important in a healthy marriage? Can we get that poll up there? So grab your cell phone, please answer that poll. I'm curious about your perspective. What do you think is most important in a healthy marriage?
Maybe it's to restore pages from Microsoft Edge because they closed some tabs. But what do you think is most important in a healthy marriage? While you're answering that poll, let me introduce you to our amazing panelists today. These are members of our counseling ministry here at CLC. When your marriage is in trouble, come on now, when your marriage is in trouble and we say, "Hey, you should see a counselor," these are some of the people that you would be seeing.
They also help us with entwined premarital counseling. So if you are seriously dating or you are already engaged, you need to get plugged into entwine because that actually kicks off, what is it, Keana? Next week? Week after next? Week 1, the 17th. Thank you, Leroy knows. I should have just come to Leroy; he's the man with answers.
I just really want to encourage you to get connected in that way. But here's the thing: this panel is the most qualified for us to have a conversation about love on the Rock because they all have healthy, strong, biblical marriages. They've all been tested and tried and true. In fact, some of these panelists have been married longer than I've even been alive, so we're talking about some serious wisdom here.
But really interesting thing I realized when you guys all came up here is that every single one of them is actually a member of our elders here at CLC as well. So there's a spiritual depth. The answers you're going to get today are not just good marital advice; it's biblical marital advice. It's from three couples that have a strong foundation in scripture and in the love of Jesus, and so they're going to be able to bless us today.
All right, do we have results for that poll? No? Maybe? Maybe not? Oh, we do! Look at that! Open communication, 80%. Panelists, before we get into your real questions, what do you think? Are they accurate? They good? That's right on, right on. Open communication. What about great sex? I feel like that's pretty important. We'll talk about that later.
Okay, we'll talk about that later. But here's our first question, and I see that you guys have already jumped on. We got a bunch of questions coming in, but our first question is, I'm going to throw it at Pam and Leroy since you're sitting right next to me. How do you manage busy seasons and not become just roommates, or as someone put it, two trains passing in the night?
Yeah, that's a very good question. I think you have to be intentional. I'm retired; this is my 14th year of retirement, so we spend a lot of time together, and we are busy. We have to be intentional. Even when we're out running back and forth, my wife is a serial entrepreneur, you know, so we're on the go constantly. But we always find time to have a date, day, night, week, whatever time we squeeze it in so that we don't become— a term I used to use all the time was "doing the walk by." You're just walking by each other.
So you have to be intentional to squeeze those times in and do those things that you know you have fun together. That's what we've learned over the years; you have to do that—be intentional.
So I would say that for women, most of us think that everything that we do is important. I think that we need to look at what's very important, what's important, and what's okay if we don't get it done that day—that it can wait until tomorrow.
In doing so, I think that both of us need to have very healthy boundaries because we can say yes to the things that we're supposed to be saying no to, and we can get very, very, very distracted. We're doing good things instead of getting to the better thing or the best thing, which God would have us to do.
With that, you have to sit down and look at your schedule—both of your schedules—and in doing so, you have to really prioritize and make sure that you are prioritizing your spouse first and foremost. Of course, having a vision also helps you to understand what your day looks like, what your week looks like, and what your month looks like.
I love it. That's wonderful. Were you just waiting for him to retire so you could put him to work? That's what I thought.
All right, I said we'd get to it later on, but it is actually the next question on my list: What does a healthy sex life look like? For anyone on the panel that wants to tackle that, make everyone else feel uncomfortable.
All right, all right, Wes took the challenge. All right, so if you could just put the video up that I just—I'm kidding, we don't have a video.
So seriously, what does a good sex life look like? What does a healthy sex life look like? So for you married people—married people, it absolutely—
I think we—what's the pastor's name? He came here, babe. He came a while ago, and he talked about that garden—Doug Weiss. Pastor Doug Weiss. He talked about that garden and what works for you may not work for another couple. But what can you use in your garden? What do you like? What don't you like? Those are just some of the basic things, you know, when we're talking about sex.
But having a healthy sex life goes beyond just the physical things that we like or may not like. It also goes to the mental state we're in. We always hear about how sex starts way before you even get into the bedroom, and it absolutely does matter how am I filling her up throughout the day? How am I filling her up throughout the week? How is she feeding me? How is she making me feel worthy all week long?
So that when we do connect, it's an enjoyable time, and it's not a task. It's not something that we have to do, but it's something that we want to do, something that we enjoy.
You got something to say? He's like, "Please take this microphone out of my hand."
I do think they say sex starts before the bedroom, and it starts in the kitchen. So that's just your intentionality of literally making sure that you meet each other's needs before then. But in terms of that, making sure you're intentional about your health, making sure you're intentional about hearing and listening—not just what you desire and what you need—and then making sure each other walks away with 100% satisfaction guaranteed.
I know that's a terrible thing to say, but I just think that it's like ministering to the mind and the spirit. They say women are microwaves and men are slow cookers, so I think that would really speak to a lot of it. So that's what I would have to say.
Awesome. I love it. So I've got to be the pastor in the room and kind of jump on something that Wes started off with, which was for married couples. Because here's the thing: if you are not married, there is no such thing as a healthy sex life. Sex is designed by God for marriage within the context of one man, one woman marriage.
So if you're trying to have a healthy sex life outside of that, it ain't happening. I felt like somebody should have been like, "Come on now, come on, come on." We can get there. There we go.
All right, I'm actually going to go to one of your guys' questions because it's already got three people telling me I need to ask this question. What do you do when your spouse is always saying they do what they feel is right, but you know that it's wrong? So you know it's wrong, but they feel like it's right. What kind of advice do you have for that?
What do you do when your spouse is always saying they do what they feel is right, but you know it's wrong?
Well, you have to remember that we're all humans. We try to hear God; we have to keep an ear to hear God. But then if you really think it's not right, just check your own heart and make sure that you're coming from the right place anyway.
But then you have to be very gentle and full of the Spirit if you're going to correct or change. Most of the time, I find I'm the one that's wrong, not her, but that's just the way it is in our marriage. It can be different in everybody's.
But anyway, you have to listen to the Spirit and follow where He's leading. The path He leads is full of joy and happiness, and it can be some hard times, but it always turns out good in the end.
Okay, Wes, Anisha, what do you do when you are 100% confident that Wes is about to do something stupid that he shouldn't do, but he is determined this is the thing that I'm supposed to do? How do you manage that? How do you handle that?
I think you have to go back to the ordination of who created marriage and who created him, and that's prayer. You can't—before you speak, pray about it and say, "God, give me the words of wisdom that he can hear you and not hear me."
It may come through a totally different person than you. The same thing you've been saying all along will come, and what's like, "You know what? I was thinking I need to make this change." Oh, really? Okay, I've only been saying it forever. Now this is really a vice versa situation right now, but I'm using it as an example.
So be intentional about your prayer, and then seek out wise counsel. If you can't hear and it's harming your marriage, don't just sit in the folly. Find out where you can find wisdom. The Bible says in a multitude of counsel, there is wisdom. I mean wisdom in a multitude of counsel. So be intentional about seeking out someone who can speak wisdom to you about what to do in these situations.
Amen. I think it goes back to what my wife has said about plans. If you've had plans, if you're just not out there willy-nilly and your wife and you have sat down and talked about your goals, your plans, your dreams, and all of that, and you see that that's not what you've talked about, go back to that conversation.
This is what we talked about, so how is that lining up with what we have already agreed upon? If we haven't agreed upon that, then you know the Bible tells us that we need to reason together. So let's reason together. Why do you want to make that decision when it seems to be going against what we've already decided upon?
Yeah, that's good. So I have a different take on it. I think that when we have conflict in marriage already, I just—y'all are supposed to be helping them with their conflict.
So I think that when you know that your husband or your wife is making a different decision and you know that it's the wrong decision, first of all, if they're not filled with the Holy Spirit, I think that we need to pray that they feel that they're filled with the Holy Spirit.
Reason being is because I think that in marriages and in relationships, too many times people try to make the other person do what's right when you can't. The Holy Spirit is the convictor. So if, first and foremost, if they're not filled with the Holy Spirit, they need to be filled with the Holy Spirit. That's where your prayer starts.
Then, as Nisha said, you can just pray that they would have a change of heart. Sure, if Brent would have given the explanation that he gave to Wes and Nisha, I would have been able to make a comment, but now I've got the comment after.
So years ago, Tim, a salesman came to the house and wanted to sell us windows for the house for $10,000. That was way back then, okay? Just like Leroy said, I mean, I'm thinking to myself, "My gracious, this man is going to spend $10,000 on windows?"
We have really lived a life of goals and dreams, and we do needs and wants every year, and there were never any windows on any section. So I am praying. I am telling all my friends, "Please pray. This man is going to buy these windows."
When all of a sudden, I felt the Holy Spirit say to me, "Melanie, ask him where are the windows anywhere in your budget? Where is it in goals and dreams and needs?" I did, and he looked at me shocked and said, "Well, it's nothing there."
Then I said to him, "If we spend this $10,000 on windows, what are we going to sacrifice in all these things that you and I have talked about together—dreams, wants, needs?" He said, "Well, you want to say what you said."
I just really agree with the praying, but I believe also the Holy Spirit can actually bring something because it didn't feel it. When he first started talking about that, it just scared me.
As the time I kept praying, I had that answer. So my husband and I really feel like sharing your dreams and your needs and your goals are super important to a happy marriage, and so they've really helped us through a lot of times in these years.
So I love it. That's awesome. I'm going to come right back to you guys for the next question just because you touched on money. The next question I had is: Is it okay to have separate bank accounts in marriage? What are your thoughts on that?
Separate bank accounts? I know when you first come into marriage, you have separate bank accounts, but the Lord has brought you two together as one, and finances are part of that coming together.
I know when you get saved, you know, what do they say? There are two or three salvations: there's your soul, and there's your wallet, and I can't remember what the third one is.
But when you come into marriage, you have those same areas that have to come in together. I really don't think that you need separate bank accounts or checking accounts.
What I hear sometimes is they'll say, "Oh yeah, well, I need to have my own checking account so when we get a divorce, I'll have my money." It's like, okay, so that's like starting off thinking you're going to get a divorce, and that's not God's plan.
So we know that. I just don't think that's a way to do it. I'm not saying you might not have a little account for something like the things that you know, like your allowance account, kind of almost.
I tend to be a saver, so my allowance account gets bigger, and so having it in a bank is maybe a good thing. Melanie's allowance account is very small, so she keeps it; she spends it as she gets it.
So that might be the only way I would think that, you know, within our budgets, we do have some separate allowance.
Well, and praise God for allowances, and that is separate. I mean, that's the wonderful thing about an allowance; the other person isn't dictating what you spend and all of that.
But there is definitely a difference as far as if you've married somebody that's a different orientation—if you're a spender and he's a saver or vice versa—you definitely need to get on the same page.
Tim and I, the way it happened for us, our church taught us about budgeting many years ago, and it was a wonderful plan. It's really helped us to get on the same page because although I'm hearing now that 50% of marriages are failing because of gaming—that was a recent statistic I heard in his sermon last week—but the reality is, as a close second to that is finances and financial problems.
The reality is for us, the budget and the strategies for how to get control of your finances helped us wonderfully because we both were professionals, and money was really never a problem for us. But because I'm a spender and he's a saver, we did fight like cats and dogs about what we were going to do with that money.
Awesome. I love it. Can I add a little bit? Sure, real quick.
I believe you can have separate accounts, but you can't have secret accounts. Everything has to be out in front. If you have two accounts, they should be designated because some people have house accounts; some people have other accounts that they pay different things out of.
So if you're being responsible that way, I don't see anything wrong with having the separate accounts when you've designated money. This day and age, you can send money everywhere.
But secret accounts where you're going to the casino—excuse me.
Or why are you pointing at me? I was just pointing. We saw your car. I was just pointing randomly.
Those type of things—so no secret accounts.
All right, so I'm actually—this is an audience question, but I'm actually curious about the answer because all of you have had kids. You've got grown kids; you're working on grandkids now—all of that fun stuff. I'm still living with the kids part.
So how do you balance the marriage relationship and the kids?
Good question. So from somebody who has four grown children, they're all married and have moved out of the house. But when they were—yeah, somebody tell us your secrets. How did you get them out of the house?
Man, we don't have enough time on this show for that. But one of the things that we did—and this goes for every marriage, and I know that it's kind of unheard of—but we absolutely came first, and then the kids came second.
So whatever we had—our plans, our goals, whatever we had going on was first, number one priority. Then whatever the kids needed, we took care of them.
I think the mistake—I shouldn't say mistake—but some of the things that a lot of parents do, which kind of goes along with the other questions, is they kind of use the kids as a crutch.
So when they're not really getting along, communicating properly, things like that, they lean on the kids. We're always keeping busy, taking the kids here, taking them there, and then when the kids are grown and gone, you're looking at each other, and you don't really know each other because you used them as a crutch.
So date nights—priority nights—make your bedroom a sanctuary. Every night, our door was locked, period. There were no kids, four, five, six sleeping in our bed.
Things like that, they understood. Our kids basically got sick of us, you know? Now that they're grown, they're like, "Man, you guys are going out of town again?" Yep, see you when we get back.
I think also, and to Wes's point, it was Dr. James Dobson who shared that on Moody many moons ago when we first got married, and that's what we heard. You could be the soccer mom, you could be the ballet mom, you could be the carpool mom, but what are you to each other?
That's what comes first, and your children would be watching that and will want to—you would want them to emulate a great marriage of your intentionality about each other.
However, husbands, help your wives with the children. Wives, be intentional about looking nice, you know, with at night or in the day. I'm just saying that because we forget about ourselves and focus so much on the children that we forgot about why we fell for each other.
So just be intentional about making sure that you do what's necessary throughout the day so when your time, whether it's day or night, be intentional about making sure you spend time together and having FaceTime together—not just digital FaceTime, but FaceTime together.
Come on!
So I was—Tim and I were the couple that the string fellas just talked about. We were both—we both worked, and we were very active in the church here. We've been here 25 years.
So the thing is, when my daughter Haley went away to college, we looked at each other and said, "We've got to do something because how are we going to live with each other like this for the rest of our lives?"
So I'm going to just be transparent and tell you what helped us, okay? Because we weren't the couple that had a date night. We didn't.
Because we just—I don't know, we thought we were just so busy that there just wasn't enough time, or maybe the sitter was too expensive, or I don't know why we didn't do it, but we just didn't.
But some things that can help, even if you're in that setting, is my husband and I started doing couple's devotionals every morning. Those little tiny five or ten-minute sections helped us to be able to start communicating about problems that other couples are having.
So the cool thing was we started doing these devotions, and then we found ourselves starting to pray about each other. The thing about it is I want to encourage you intercessors out there: when you're praying with your spouse, you do not pray about the nations and the missions and the pastors and the church. You pray about what you two are experiencing.
If you want intimacy in your marriage—in other words, you want to go deeper—you've got to be praying about things that are in your life. What is your husband dealing with at work? What are you dealing with at work? What challenges are you having with your children? You're praying about those kinds of things.
I love it. And you have to do it face to face, holding hands, okay? You want to know that your spouse is with you and understands where you are and is backing you up.
When you do that through prayer, then you can go through the rest of your day saying, "Hey, I've at least got my wife on my side."
So it's really important. I mean, we—you know, probably anybody that's married here says, "I pray for my wife," but do you pray holding hands and looking at each other? There's a big difference—a big difference when you're holding hands and looking at each other.
It doesn't take a long time. You know, just, you know, what she's going through—something ask her what she's going through. If there's something different that she needs that specific day, pray for that.
And it makes a big difference. It really, really, really does.
Yeah, I've noticed there's a big difference between just praying for your spouse and praying with your spouse. The moments that I've seen my wife struggling and I've gone and just prayed with her in that moment, I think did way more than if I had just gone to my office somewhere and prayed a little prayer.
So I love that, Brent. The other thing that really helped us and continues to help us through the years since my daughter went away to college and then my son was life groups. We got involved in some marriage life group, and that helped us so much.
Because the reality is you find that there are other people that are dealing just with the same things you are—communication problems, conflict resolution, you know? And you've got a support group that's really speaking into your life.
So for all these years—and my daughter's 37 now—so since she's gone away to college, we've been involved in a marriage life group.
Love it. All right, I'm going to come back to Wes and Anisha. Your response a minute ago just really tells me that I don't have to ask the first part of this question. That was how important is dating your spouse? Because it sounds like that's pretty important.
But any advice on how to actually do that? I think a lot of couples, they're dating, then they get married, and something drastically changes in the approach to the relationship. How can you keep dating your spouse even after marriage?
Join a life group! But anyway, no, that's a real thing. Start a life group.
I think the other thing is find—write a list of the things you used to do and the things you love today. Because what you loved yesterday, 20 years ago when you were 25, you may not love today.
So be intentional about finding out what you like to do together now. Wes has recently liked the range. I don't like the range, but I will—I’m going to go because that's something he likes right now.
Now, what do I like? I may like chick flicks; I may like bowling. But be intentional about finding out what each other likes. That's the first thing.
The second thing is put a date on it. Don't just wait to say, "Oh, we're going to get together and go out this weekend." Find out what day works for you all and make sure that you stand by the date.
Get that mutual calendar together, you know what I mean? Where you know, "Oh yeah, we have a date this night." I hear couples do it all the time.
Every week now, we're together a lot, so you know, but early on, we were intentional about those date nights.
Talking about it, finding out what you each other likes to do, and compromising with— even if you don't like to do it.
Good. Another important thing: date nights don't have to—they don't necessarily mean you have to spend $100, $300. A date night could simply be the two of you going and getting some ice cream or lingo or Sweet Frog, whatever it is.
It doesn't have to break the bank. Sometimes it could be as simple as just going driving to the lake or any lake or any park, getting a simple meal.
I know during COVID, we would even sometimes when we double-dated, but during COVID, we would go get something to eat and just sit in the park and eat it.
We'd get our little chairs out. It doesn't have to break the bank, especially when you have kids. I understand how do you get away from the kids.
Just steal some time away. It doesn't have to be long. We've encouraged couples to just—how about the two of you, believe it or not, just go to one of these fancy supermarkets and just walk around and eat free samples.
You know, enjoy yourselves. It doesn't have to break the bank because a lot of times when we tell couples, "You need to go on a date," they say, "Oh, we don't have that. We don't have the finances."
You know, it doesn't have to be that much. It could be as long as the two of you are intentional about spending some time together.
I love it. That's beautiful. All right, so what I'm going to do is I'm going to combine an audience question with one of our questions.
So the audience question is: What do you do when you feel like you're not being heard or understood by your spouse? Then I'm going to combine that with our question: What tools do you use for healthy communication in marriage?
So kind of, you know, what do you do when you feel like you're not being heard or understood by your spouse, and what tools for communication would you—if I was coming to one of you guys and sitting down saying, "My wife and I aren't communicating," what tools would you give me?
Yeah, thanks. So one, communication is a giant word. What does that mean? We're not communicating. Does it mean that we talk too much? We don't say enough? Or when we do talk, we're not being understood? That's a big word.
So you've got to kind of break that down to what does that mean when you guys are saying that you're not communicating well?
What's the question again? I don't want to be—what do you do when you feel like you're not being heard or understood by your spouse?
That goes back to kind of like everything we've talked about. One, pray about it. Absolutely take it to God. Two, pray for God's wisdom in your words because there are some things that I—Wes has managerial tones.
So what is that? See, you can see that she did not pray about that first; she just—it just ripped out.
So back to what I was saying: pray for the wisdom because sometimes there are some things that need to be said. How do you say them in a way that they can be received and not just you're saying them to make yourself feel good and you got it out your chest?
You know, because I hear all the time, "I'm just going to shoot from the hip." Well, you know, that doesn't always work. You can shoot from the hip, but if you're missing and hitting nothing, you might as well have kept that bullet in your gun; it was wasted.
So always pray, and when you pray about it, two things are going to happen: either God's going to give you the wisdom to know what to say, or He will send somebody with wise counsel to come by and drop a seed, and they'll receive it, and they'll act like they came up with it, and you were never there and never mentioned it.
Not that you have ever done that, but we're supposed to be adults. You have to have an adult conversation. An adult conversation, like the Bible says, we have to reason together.
That's not arguing; that's not taking the lead or having what kind of conversation was that? Managerial conversation?
I think my wife has that too. But you have to—it's like Tim and Mel, you have to sit down together face to face and talk about what's going on.
Don't use the statements, you know, like you said, "You did," "You always." You have to learn or relearn your conversation—how to talk to each other so you don't sound like a manager, so you don't sound like a dictator.
You want to come across as a caring individual. When you have that conversation, then you can—you have to hear, not just talk. You have to hear what the person is saying because a person won't listen to you if they don't think you care about them.
Yeah, that's good. When they know that you care about them and about what you're talking about, they will listen, and then you will be able to resolve a lot of things that you're going through.
I love that. All right, I'm going to jump to an audience question because this is—I'm curious your answer for this one. Should husbands be yes men if they have an alpha wife just in order to keep the peace?
Right? That was a good—whoever asked that one, that was a heavy one. Go ahead.
That's an alpha woman I married to right here. So if you're going to communicate, you have to—it takes two people. You can't be just managerial.
You have to have—you have to do both sides of communication. Communication is a two-way street.
We, in our life group, we've probably spent almost every other season in some kind of a communication type thing because it's so important, okay?
And there's all kinds of just counseling-type things that you can tell people, but you know, active listening and other kinds of things like that.
So it's not just the one talking, but the one listening has to be able to understand, and not just understand mentally, but to understand physically and spiritually also what's going on.
Because sometimes the words that are coming out of the mouth aren't exactly what's underneath, and you've got to be sensitive to that in your communications.
And so yes is not always the right answer. You're not just a yes man. We are a team, and we've discussed our dreams and our needs, and those communication things nearly always are talking about those kinds of things in some way.
If you're U—when you came together, you said you were going to take care of each other, and taking care of each other is talking honestly and hearing the other person and being able to respond in a spiritual, godly way back.
That's good. So I know that there's a running joke, right, that goes—I think the saying is that whenever you want a happy home, that you just say, "Yes, dear," or you know.
And so I just don't think that the man has to always say yes because we balance one another out. Just as the man has strength, the woman has strength, and we also have weaknesses.
I think that if you never really allow your voice to be heard, then that's a deficit in the relationship.
I think that if a person is always saying yes, they have to check themselves to find out what is making you—because that's not submission.
Submission, you know, and so sometimes we can think that that's submission, but it's not. You have a voice, and you need to be able to use your voice so that the relationship can be healthy and whole.
I love it. You know, I think also we need to realize that you've married someone very different, okay? When you're dating, it's very, very attractive if you're a right hand to get a left hand to go with you.
But the problem comes in that you can have a lot of conflict because you're so very different, okay? Yes, I'm the manager, okay? I'm also very active. I'm a morning person.
Do you know I've married somebody who is a night owl? Okay? So we got to learn, and even coming up with a couple's devotional, that was hard—hard because we were on different clocks.
Okay? Anybody here in the—relate to this? You're on a different page. But the reality is God has brought you together, and maybe you're tempted to say, "I made a mistake."
You did not make a mistake because God is directing our lives. The Bible says the king is in the Lord's hand; He directs it whithersoever He wills.
If you can submit to God and say, "Not my will, but thine be done," we can learn that although we're different—very, very different—we can do this.
Can you hold this instead of this? Good. I like it.
Hey, we've got a lot of questions that have been coming in. There's no way we're going to be able to answer all of these.
So check out the Between Sermons podcast. We will be answering more questions this week on the podcast.
But we're going to go to another poll, and the question for the poll—so grab your cell phone—what do you and your spouse fight about most?
So we're going to start talking about some conflict in marriage. So what do you fight about the most? Money? Sex? Parenting styles? Unmet expectations?
While you're answering that poll, we're going to go on to the next question I have. This is an open question for any of you.
I've got to put it in air quotes. So it's the, "I don't think I'm in love with my spouse. What do I do?"
Okay, why are you not in love? First of all, before you start looking at your spouse, find out where you are individually.
I think that's so important—self-reflection. What stage of life are you in? What is going on with your mental state?
What are you not in love? Are you in love with yourself? Because a lot of times we blame our spouses for what we're not, and we are just not happy ourselves.
So that's the first thing: do a self-check. The second thing is I think finding out what that means, "I'm not in love."
So write your list. What are you not in love with? Are there things that we talked about earlier that you wish you could be doing and that you're not doing them?
So what does that mean? Because that whole "in love"—yeah, I really think that that's a crucial thing for you to just do a self-reflection, write a list of what you're not in love with, and then do you want to talk about it with your spouse?
You don't have to start off with, "I'm not in love with you anymore." You can start off with, "You know what? There's some changes going on, and I don't exactly know where they are, and our relationship is just not where it used to be.
So I really am concerned about our marriage. Can we talk about it?" But a lot of times, people have itching ears in other directions and distractions that are making you say, "I'm not in love."
So consider what your motives are when you say that, and then investigate it with yourself.
I think it goes back to one of the poll questions about unrealistic expectations. You're looking to that person to do something for you that you can only do for yourself, and God can only do it.
So if you're looking—I hear the expression that he's not making me, or they're not making me happy when they're not supposed to make you happy.
If it's an expectation you have out there for that person and they're not meeting it, then you start to tell yourself, "Well, I'm not because this isn't happening."
And they're not the one that's supposed to make that happen.
So I think that when we say, "I'm in love" versus "I love you" versus "I'm not in love with you," and so love, of course, is a fruit of the Spirit.
And so that's something that we hold on to. The other person may be doing some things that may not align with your beliefs or align with the direction in which you're going.
But that doesn't mean that you have to fall out of love with that individual.
Again, as Nisha said, it's a covenant that has already been formed between the two of you.
So the areas where you're not in alignment, then those are the areas that you need to talk about. Those are the things that you need to see what you can interject some other things or either you can remove some things from your marriage.
But again, the love versus the in love, I just think that the love is what you need to hold on to because that is what God has commanded us to do.
Good. And I just want to say one more thing, and this may be crucial for the counseling team, but I'm going to just say it: don't wait until you're in crisis to figure out that you need to get some help.
I mean, a lot of people wait until the 911s. If you have a good marriage, seek out counsel. Go to a life group.
You know, be intentional about investing in your marriage. Don't wait until it's a crisis.
If you're feeling some kind of way about yourself—I never forget when you don't even know you're going through early menopause, and you think it's your spouse, and it's you.
Be intentional about finding out what's going on before the 911 crisis because you can live before the 911s, but you have to do the work.
That's good. That's very true. And men—ladies, men have manopause. It's called a midlife crisis. Sometimes they go out and buy a Corvette or something.
But who would such a thing? I don't know anybody on this panel that would go out and buy a—[Laughter]—Corvette.
Was AAR, wasn't it? I'm just jealous because your car is nicer than mine.
So I agree, and I'm going to keep it short. Everything in—so we have a program; it's called Entwine. If you are dating or you have a fiancé, this is a course that you need to go through.
Even if you don't have a date on the calendar where you're going to get married, but these are the things—these are the things that you would talk about and explore and have some power and some weapons in your bag before you get to those areas so that you're not surprised five years and ten years down the line.
So Entwine, for those—we start on the 17th.
Yeah, and honestly, it is so important to us as a church that we make it a prerequisite. So if you want to get married here at CLC or you want one of our pastors to do your wedding, you have to take Entwine.
If you don't go to Entwine, we ain't marrying you. It ain't happening.
All right, what's the results for the—sorry, we're running low on time. Let's get these results in. Unmet expectations was the biggest reason why people fight, and this is a freebie for you.
You know how you handle that? Communicate! You got to talk about it, right? Like you got to communicate.
All right, so with that, there's a question from the audience. This might be our last one. We'll try and squeeze in one more, but what are some ways to explain things to your spouse without hurting their feelings or offending them?
You know, Brent, I want to put a plug in, and this will have something to do with that, I promise. But one of the things that we did do when our children were young—my daughter was four, okay?
When we went away for a weekend, we co-oped with another couple, and they watched our children while we went away.
We went away, and we said, "Wow, this is addictive. We need to do this every year." So we started doing that every year.
In that time, you see, because you're away from all those distractions and the phone and, as women, all the things there are to do, it's so much easier in that environment to be able to talk about your needs and talk about those kinds of things.
So I definitely would put in a plug that if you're doing a budget, if you can possibly afford to do some away time—even if it's just two nights a weekend once a year—that really is a valuable experience because you are then able to talk about it in a non-stressful way.
You know, also, Tim and I find that a restaurant or a coffee shop is a good place sometimes to talk about things because you're not going to yell at each other. You're not going to get all worked up, and those are good places.
It's a neat strategy, and if you came in one car, you can't get up and leave. [Laughter]
So the question is, "What are some ways to explain things to your spouse without hurting their feelings or offending them?"
So it's kind of that communication piece.
So I am married to somebody whose words mean everything, so how I say things really matters, even if it's good, bad, and different.
So I have to be very careful how I say things. If it's going to be something that's constructive criticism, I'm going to make sure that at least three or four things I have complimented her on that are good and that are going great.
And that just doesn't mean you say them right in the heat of the moment. You look good; you look nice; you look great; you smell great. But you know, your feet stink.
So sorry, you know, that's not how that works. This is an ongoing thing, and you're building them up so that when you have to have the hard conversations, it's understood.
You pray for God's wisdom to be able to say those things so that they can be received as well.
And I was talking fast, but go ahead.
And don't expect your spouse, when you're sharing with them those things, to just be like, "Oh, thank you, Wes. That was so nice of you to give me that constructive criticism."
Give them space and time to process what they've said, and then come back. Spouses that get your feelings hurt, come back and say, "You know what? What did you mean? I really didn't understand," or "You know, that did hurt my feelings, but let's talk about that further."
Or it hurts so bad that, you know, maybe we need to see a mediator to talk about this so to make sure that we don't—you know, this doesn't lead to further offense.
You really need to find out why you were offended in the first place. Was it the truth, or was it something that you feel like your spouse may have missed?
So be intentional about knowing what stage of what you need in terms of the feelings being hurt that you're in.
In terms of like, do you need to see a counselor? Do you need to see a mediator? Do you need some time to be still and think about it?
Somebody said this to us—a counselor said, "Give it 24 hours and then come back and revisit it before you just dive into your offense."
Or don't hold on to your comments because that is important because it could damage the marriage later just to keep the peace.
No, no, no, no. You are destroying your marriage trying to just keep the peace. If it's something that's important to you, be intentional about making sure you take some time to talk about it.
That's good. You know, the other thing I would put a plug for is there's a book called "I Said You Heard." It talks about temperaments and the fact that we don't hear things the same way when we have very different temperaments.
Often, you've married somebody that's a very different temperament. There's also some great books on there, "The Space Between Us."
Okay, that's talking about Enneagrams. All of those things are knowledge, and that knowledge is powerful.
When you begin to understand what your spouse is like and they are very different than you, it's easier to give them grace because you realize that they're not going to be able to think of it and feel like you do.
It's impossible for them, and yet we want so badly for them to be just like us. But then you'd have two right hands and two left hands, and that is not a good combination, no matter how much the devil is saying you need somebody just like you.
That is a lie from the pit of hell.
All right, well, we're going to end on that note—the pit of hell.
But here's the thing: we got tons more questions. We are going to do our best to answer these during the podcast this week.
I would also encourage you, if you're a member of CLC and you—some of these questions, they're pretty heavy.
If you are in need of counseling, please email counseling@clc.tv so that we can connect with you and go beyond just a brief answer to this.
But we really want to make sure that here at CLC, we have healthy, strong, amazing marriages.
And I should have said this at the beginning: for those singles in the room, next week is all about you. So, you know, take what you heard today. This is good information; this is great for relationships in general.
But next week, we're going to be talking about singles.
You guys appreciate this amazing team? Thank you, guys.
Go for it. I just want to make one mention of Entwine because we talked about what we didn't talk about is that it's also for serious dating couples.
So if you're seriously dating and you're not sure if marriage is the direction in which you want to go, you can sign up also for our next week is when we start.
That's great. All right, if you want to stand, we're going to pray the blessing.
I'm going to invite our altar ministry team to come on down to the front. If you need prayer for anything at all, this team would love to partner with you in prayer.
I want to remind you we do have our annual business meeting after the second service right here in the auditorium. It will be streamed online as well.
And then we hope to see you this Wednesday night. If you are a lady, if you're a guy, I don't want to see you because it's a women's night—CLC Women.
And so, yeah, 7 o'clock on Wednesday.
I really feel like if you're in a marriage right now that is facing some challenges, some struggles, this team is here to pray with you.
We do believe in the power of prayer.
So I think step one for you is to come down to the front, receive prayer. Step two would be to email counseling@clc.tv because we pray about it, and then we talk about it.
We work on the things that need to be worked on so that we can be healthy and whole.
Sound good? Maybe some of Jo...
on Mar 10, 2024
